Pitch control via MIDI

For topics related to using MsPinky inside the Max/MSP graphical programming environment
hobo
Posts: 17
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:37 pm

Pitch control via MIDI

Postby hobo » Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:43 pm

Hi all.


My turntable is a lovely old direct drive denon with no pitch fader.

On the 33rpm setting it plays files slower than it should (slower than the orig recording)

What I want to do is correct this and use a midi controler as a pitch slider

Presumably its fairly straight forward to modify the mspinkymax4live device patch to add or subtract numbers from the incoming velocity/position
numbers from the turntable?

first of all can it be done?

and if so, what object/operators should I use and which inlets on mptcfs_sa~
to connect them to?

cheers

hobo
hobo
Posts: 17
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:37 pm

Postby hobo » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:16 pm

no takers?

is it too simple to merit a response or just not possible?

come on people!
tsutek
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:53 am

Postby tsutek » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:01 am

Just to make sure - you are using the correct tc vinyl gen setting in your config to match the tc record that you are using? Does your vinyl deck have a way to check that the platter is spinning at the correct speed (a strobe light at the edge of the platter etc)?

This would be doable with a mptcfs~ object? You'd take the velocity signal and offset it slightly before sending it onwards.. Problem is, AFAIK there isn't a separate mspinky-compatible signal-controllable audio player that you could feed that modified signal into.. And I can't help you with that, my max chops are nowhere near that calibre for me to come up with one.

One more thing - you said that the playback is slower than default? You could try inserting a pitch-shifter plugin before the tc input to compensate a lil' although pitch shifting upwards tends to be more problematic than pitch-shifting downwards.. Needless to say, if the pitch-shifter messes with the phase of your TC signal you're screwed, so YMMV..

Heh, just thought of the most ghetto solution - pitch your audio files up in an audio editor to offset ? A painful solution for sure, but it should work 100% :p
hobo
Posts: 17
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:37 pm

Postby hobo » Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:54 am

thanks for the reply
dlpinkstah
Site Admin
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Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 9:17 pm

Postby dlpinkstah » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:36 pm

When you say it plays "slower" than it should, how much slower is that?

Are you by any chance using one of the 45 RPM HQ control vinyl? If so, then it's obviously going to play too slow if your turntable is set on 33-1/3 RPM.

Another cause for slow playback could be having the wrong vinyl generation choice setting in the software. Which generation of Ms Pinky vinyl are you using, and what are your vinyl generation settings in the software?
hobo
Posts: 17
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:37 pm

Postby hobo » Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:35 pm

Hey DLP,

I'm using gen 4 vinyl and standard not 45rpm and the turn table is set to 33 rpm.

If I play a non-warped track in ableton and then play the same media file through pinky, the pinky one plays slightly slower -

Its really just a case of my ancient hardware (its at leat 40 yrs old!) not spinning at precisely the right speed. If it had a pitch slider it would only need a small adjustment but it doesnt have one.

what Im trying to get my head around conceptually is whether it is possible to effectively fake a pitch slider by simple arithmetic on the velocity/position/speed etc .. numbers coming from the turntable.

Thanks guys, for your time.

take it easy,

hobo
dlpinkstah
Site Admin
Posts: 1093
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 9:17 pm

Postby dlpinkstah » Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:28 am

When you play a file in mptcfs_sa~ using the Ms Pinky control vinyl, the pitch values are passed internally from the decoder directly to the file playback code. There's no way to modify those values before they're applied to file playback. But you could use another file player (like buffer~) which allows playback pitch adjustment. Feed the other file player with the pitch signal outputs from mptcfs_sa~.
hobo
Posts: 17
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:37 pm

Postby hobo » Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:23 pm

Thats the info I was after DLP, thank you.

and have a nice day :wink:
tsutek
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:53 am

Postby tsutek » Thu Apr 05, 2012 8:49 am

I can use the buffer with the TC control? But of course! Intriguing stuff.. I take it that using a buffer for audio file playback is not going to give me decent scratching sound though?

I really think there should be a separate Pinky-TC compatible audio file player object in the MsPinky package - it would enable all kinds of wonderful opportunities for TC data manipulation, and make the whole system more usable in M4L in general. Would it be a complex thing to suss out? I mean, you already have all the code there, just a matter of separating the processes & IO..

Cheers
hobo
Posts: 17
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:37 pm

Postby hobo » Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:06 pm

hey tsutek whats TC?
sec-def
Posts: 83
Joined: Thu Nov 18, 2010 11:43 am

Postby sec-def » Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:00 pm

tsutek wrote:I can use the buffer with the TC control? But of course! Intriguing stuff.. I take it that using a buffer for audio file playback is not going to give me decent scratching sound though?

I really think there should be a separate Pinky-TC compatible audio file player object in the MsPinky package - it would enable all kinds of wonderful opportunities for TC data manipulation, and make the whole system more usable in M4L in general. Would it be a complex thing to suss out? I mean, you already have all the code there, just a matter of separating the processes & IO..

Cheers

if you just re-pitch it you should be fine. the real question is would you be able to use the time stamps on the record , which I'm pretty sure you would.
I hooked up a traktor software playing the ms pinky cd code to a midi controller and the fed that (via. re-wire I think) into the ableton m4l patch.
that way I was able to scratch via midi controller the m4l patch.
that was totally pointless but it worked.
tsutek
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:53 am

Postby tsutek » Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:27 am

hobo wrote:hey tsutek whats TC?

TC = timecode
tsutek
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:53 am

Postby tsutek » Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:32 am

sec-def wrote:if you just re-pitch it you should be fine. the real question is would you be able to use the time stamps on the record , which I'm pretty sure you would.
I hooked up a traktor software playing the ms pinky cd code to a midi controller and the fed that (via. re-wire I think) into the ableton m4l patch.
that way I was able to scratch via midi controller the m4l patch.
that was totally pointless but it worked.

What M4L patch was that? The MsPinky audio FX? That's not what I meant. What I meant that it would be neat to have 3 separate externals in the MsPinky package, one like the current mptcfs~ we currently have, one like the current mptcfssa~, and another complementing external that would be otherwise similar to mptcfssa~ object, but with inlets for the MsPinky timecode signals (that the mptcfs~ can generate) instead of just accepting audio in. That way, we would be free to make all kinds of wonderful manipulations to the timecode signals before feeding them into the audio file player part of the system.

Currently we can only have either MsPinky timecode signals (audio in -> 3 signals out)or the whole system (audio in -> audio out). So IMHO we need a third option to make the circle complete (3 signals in -> audio out). ATM if one wants the third option, it has to be built by oneself from scratch, by using something like the buffer~ object..
sec-def
Posts: 83
Joined: Thu Nov 18, 2010 11:43 am

Postby sec-def » Fri May 11, 2012 2:01 pm

it was the ms pinky audio f\x. the whole idea behind ms pinky software (for me at least) is that we, the users, can build what ever we want using
the building blocks given to us.
there are allot of re-pitching patches on here http://maxforlive.com/
so that all you have to do is take an existing platform and cannibalize that shit with the pink externals. once you're done with that all you need to do
is come back here and share your work with us :D (and give credit where it's due)

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